Great Filmmakers Dream & Work Hard
After the screening of Perth: A Geylang Massacre at Cine SG, a retrospective of Singapore films organised by the National Museum on July 2006, we were given the privilege to be acquainted with the producer of the film, Mr Juan Foo. He is a veteran film maker in Singapore and possesses years of experience in his line of interest. In this interview, he talks to us about the perils and joys of his job, being part of Perth and about being down to earth as a film maker.
About producing…
As a producer, what’s your scope of work?
A producer is mainly the chief organiser and the initiator of film projects. He’s also so-called the quality controller and the man for ensuring the film is being made into a product that can be sold, exhibited and appreciated by the audience. So, in essence the producer wears many hats, not excluding a lot of other things. Of course, if you make a film the main thing is looking for the money and finding the finance. So a lot of times, the main job for the producer is finding the finance and bringing the project together. But again that’s not the only job as a producer, because after you’ve found the finance, you have to also make sure the finance is properly spent, you also have to make sure that the stories are well-told, you have to make sure that the good people are hired, for example you got to hire a good director, a good writer and so on. There’s no hard and fast and easy way to describe what a producer does, except that probably he or she starts off the film project and leads the entire film project from idea to distribution.
So why did you choose to become a producer?
Because I’m insane, mentally unstable. But I think personally for me I like to see projects from start to finish, hence the only sadistic way of doing that is to become a producer, because ideally and in actuality the producer really sees it through from start to finish, but again, few and far between really achieve that and have the kind of scale to do that. So, for me it’s a learning curve, and maybe because it’s a learning curve that I kind of enjoy it, but not without its trials and tribulations.
So what is it like being a producer in Singapore?
I think it’s, not to really hype up or make it sound really terrible, but it’s quite difficult to be a producer in Singapore because a lot of the creative people prefer to be directors. We have a lot of directors but not enough producers. Directors are basically the creative vision behind film, but they need producers to drive the entire project, and the product obviously. So we lack a lot of producers because nobody wants to take responsibility and organize, and step up the film project. Everybody would like to just be the director, to dabble into creativity and wants and whims and fancy. A lot of directors would kill me for saying this but, I think a lot of people prefer to be directors because in a lot of ways it is less culpable, in a lot of ways it is more individualised, and obviously, perhaps it is more creative in that sense. So I would say that people in Singapore don’t like to be producers because number one, there are not many of us around to share resources and information, number two in general it is just difficult because of the very limited resources you can pull and develop the project in Singapore.
How long have you been in this industry?
I’ve been around for 10 years.
Before that?
I was the first batch of guinea pigs from Ngee Ann Polytechnic FSV program way back in 1993. We started off with 40 people. It was a govt. initiative to grow film making talents in Singapore. So before I was involved as a professional, I did film school in FSV in NP, before it changed to film and media studies.
What’s your most memorable experience as a producer?
If you ask me to name one I can’t really name one, but I think I derive satisfaction in developing projects, which is sitting down with the writers or the director, developing the story idea into a product. You know, talking about where the story goes, how the story can attract people, whether people would want to watch the movie, and try to balance that with the certain creative and artistic value of the director and the writer, and generally just seeing through a project. I think every project is very different, so when you finish a particular piece of project, you definitely feel a sense of satisfaction. Particular examples I can’t recall, but I enjoy myself the most when I’m developing story ideas and script ideas, and then seeing them through, which can mean raising the funds, getting people interested, or just putting people together.
About Perth…
Talking about Perth, how did you become part of the film?
Perth was directed and initiated by the film maker Djinn. We all made his first feature film, Return to Pontianak, and just off the tail end of finishing that movie, we knew that he had this other script that he wanted to do called Perth. He showed it to us, us meaning the other producers. We felt that it was definitely something worthy of being developed and produced in a film, because mainly the story talks about, in one sense of the word, the story is a social drama about people who have been marginalised. In a sense I think we felt that it is a movie that should be made, and it is film that not many people would want to make. So we decided to bite the bullet and see how far we can go with it.
What are the things that you worry about while making Perth?
I think as producers we are constantly worried about what would be the sale value, because once the movie is made we have to try hard to get it shown and get it distributed. I think a lot of times we are also worried that the director’s creative vision is either affected by he himself or other external forces, and hence will not make the film what it’s supposed to be. We definitely worry about whether or not there’s enough money to make the film, and whether the money we’ve raised is allocated to the correct resources. Generally, for Perth the main worries are organisational, things like the creative vision, the focus of the film, the budget and eventually now, how far we are pushing it for sales and distribution overseas.
Any interesting things you had to do for the film?
The film was half-funded by the Singapore Film Commission, and the SFC is very active in co-funding Singapore films. An interesting point to note is that we had to apply for the funding twice, because for the first time the SFC actually rejected us. I think they felt that the script was a bit too edgy and controversial. So one of the things I did was to actually re-apply an appeal to the SFC to say that hey, this is something worth coming in for, because it stands out and it will stand out as more than a movie, it’s almost like a statement that we are looking back at a situation that Singapore has, not say created, but in every society there is a marginalised group of people, so it’s good to put that on screen, especially for Singapore because we are progressing so fast that we don’t really look back. So an interesting part was that we wanted to tell this story the first time we were rejected, so we pushed it again and eventually they understood that we wanted to make this movie almost like a social statement. … Producing is a lot of balancing things, it is a huge balancing act, it is a huge quality control situation. I guess there were interesting things that happened along the way, like getting sponsors and getting things to work on smoothly. But it has really been quite a journey bringing everybody into this movie, really quite a journey.
Why do you think the director made the film this way?
I think Djinn is very expressive, I think he has an innate ability to pick out interesting issues or nuances from the public, from his friends from the characters that he has met and turn them into story elements. I think he has told this story to the best of his ability, according to his vision and storytelling ability. So it is interesting to see how from script it has transported itself into screen. I think he has put in his ability in looking for cast, picking out and sieving out certain nuances and putting it in films, pushing for his own personal voice to the film. So I think it is an interesting part of Djinn.
About the Local Film Culture…
What is interesting to note is that a lot of times Singapore is painted as this very nice place, so when we show them [in Perth] a possible under belly, which is what we have shown, people stand up and say “woah”, you know, is this what Singapore is about? Or, beyond the nice, clinical layer there’s something pretty scary and dirty.
What are your encounters like with young film makers?
I think young film makers are… I think everybody wants to be a film maker, but whether you can be or you possess the innate ability to tell stories is a different thing. I think the words passion and creative are highly overused words, and words like hard work and tenacity mean more than passion and being creative. We have a lot of young film makers in Singapore, and some of them are very talented, but I can’t help feeling that some of are them are in it because it’s glamorous and a lot of hype and so forth, and I guess the irony is we have to see who survives ultimately. Because I think if you are a __ film maker, you’ll definitely want to retain some sort of creative integrity and commercial viability, and those that can balance both of these will ultimately survive.
It’s quite sad, isn’t it.
It’s not sad la, but I think it’s really the hard and fast rule and it’s really a very pragmatic view of things. You can have a lot of people saying I want to make a film, I’m a film maker, I’m creative, I’m passionate, but ultimately only very few can make films, only very few will make films, the rest are probably just coffee parlour film makers, and ultimately an even smaller percentage of these people will make very good films, and eventually make films their career. So it’s a natural attrition process, I think. There are many young film makers, but in the long run it’ll be interesting to see how many really retain their voice and their balance and just work?
How do you think the industry is progressing now?
I think the industry is progressing very slowly, but I think in the correct direction. I always like to use the word evolution, because I think we’re in the very evolutionary phase of our media culture, our film culture. Again, it’s very natural because we are a very young country, so I think these things come in slowly. Technological and economic advancements are easier to attain, but your own voice, your own national pride or culture is definitely a longer road, and we’re still on that road. I think film and cinema development in Singapore has a voice and has a culture for us, is very important. That’s the part that I see things evolving. Although they are slow, again, slow means a lot of things, I rather slow and steady than suddenly we want to have an instant tree, we plant the seed and two hours later we have a big tree, and so forth. So I think right now we are in a good position. We are going in the correct direction, it’s just slow.
How do you think the people that are studying film-related industry can speed up the process?
I think people that are delving in the film education area really have to still tell themselves that film making is still an art and a craft, whatever it is I think the artistic and aesthetic elements have to be balanced off with the craft and the skills of telling story, the so-called commercial, and the storytelling skill, they have to be balanced. So anybody that is studying film now has to be aware that there is not only the art part, there is the skill part, and there is also the mainstream part. I think people have to be very aware of that. Without these 3 elements, it’s very difficult to make film and cinema the cultural statement of Singapore. A lot of times, for people in film schools, they may be too caught up with the technology side of things. They may think that I have certain equipment, and therefore I’m a good film maker. Which I think is a very wrong thing. I think film making and the ability to tell stories really comes from within, and comes from the awareness that it is the art and the craft of telling stories for the screen, more than I have a very good super computer, I have the latest camera, and therefore I’m a very good film maker. I think that is a common mistake that people should note.
What is your opinion on Singaporeans and films? How do you think they look at films?
I think most Singaporeans treat films as escapism, which means that they don’t really appreciate films other than for its commercial quality, special effects, bla blab la, chick flicks and so forth. But there is a small growing number of people who appreciate Singapore cinema, a number that as a film maker myself I’m thankful for. So I think the idea is to slowly educate the audience, and slowly push and change the mindset that films can be reflective of life also, not necessarily escapism, films can educate, can inform can inspire, so on and so forth. People need to know that, so that people will embrace films more. And that comes with the cash investment, because how do you change the mindset of Singapore audience, is to make more films. But to make more films you have to have that kind of infrastructure and background support, and that is actually built from a demand for Singapore films, which we don’t have because the audience is not educated.
What do you think is lacking in the film culture in Singapore?
What’s lacking predominantly is the awareness that cinema is number one a cultural voice, (I’m speaking from a business point of view), a business and number 3 cinema is something that can travel and is exportable. I think once people are aware of that their mindset will change, because they can see a certain 3 part concept about cinema and film in general. One is the business, which means commercialism, one is the voice, which means your culture, and one is exportability, which is how other people from the rest of the world look at you. I think if people are aware of this, the mindsets will change and a certain demand for local films will follow. But It’s a evolutionary phase, I think, when you’re aware you’ll appreciate, when you appreciate you’ll allow yourself to be more open, when you’re more open you’ll be hopefully inspired. It’s not as if it’s the reaching of enlightenment, but I think once you’re aware of that you’ll know how to watch films with a better and more sophisticated eye. We were talking about chick flicks just now… yeah you can watch a chick flick and gain thorough escapism from that, but you can watch maybe a local film and get inspired or educated about yourself and the past. You can watch an art movie and get maybe inspired to do your own art and so forth. I think that is the ultimate level of appreciation that Singapore people should hopefully be aware about and change towards, again film is just not escapism.
Why do you think Singaporeans is lacking in awareness?
Generally I think the Singaporeans are bombarded by so many sorts of media, so much so that they are spoilt for choice, they are easily distracted and their attention span is very limited. I think also …Singaporeans I think are lazy to find out more, everything needs to be spoon fed. So it’s tough to know about such things because there isn’t enough sustained attention to issues and things and so forth. So, it comes back to the awareness situation; whereby you need to be aware to give it due force, but yeah I think it’s just too much of a media shower, so to speak. Whether it’s really wrong or right is up to the individual but there’s too many things around already.
How do you think Singaporeans can become more critical and appreciative?
You can only be critical and appreciative if you watch films. But Singaporeans don’t watch films, period, or rather don’t watch a variety of films, period. You can’t afford to be critical without knowing what you’re criticising. It comes back to my comment just now about coffee parlour film makers; who just sit at Starbucks all day and go, oh yeah, I want to make this film, if I were the director of this I’ll do this and do that, but you know that they’ll never have the guts to make their own film and it’s very sad. I think it’s a matter of going out there and doing it, either making films or watching more films, coffee parlour people will just want to talk about films, whether or not they have actually watched and appreciated films you really don’t know, because it’s just coffee shop talk. So if Singaporeans really want to claim themselves as a developed country and a sophisticated people, I think it’s important to have a film culture, a film making culture or a film appreciation culture for that matter. Singaporeans should and hopefully get to watch a variety of films other than Hollywood blockbusters. Again, Hollywood blockbusters are fine, they are the no “brainer” escapist films, but there are so many other films that are very powerful that are glazed over, because nobody really bothers, and that’s that.
What do you think is the difference between film Indus. And media Indus?
I think the word media is too generalist, and I think the word media is almost an academic concept that is over justified and a description. I think film is probably the second oldest form of media, but the most modern form of art. So it’s an interesting pairing, and it’s correct to say film is media, but now when you say media it means a lot of other things. So I think film is slightly different from media; if it’s done well it’s slightly closer to the heart, it doesn’t get mixed into your other forms of media, like advertising etc. film really has a semantic message or a semantic media stance alone based on its intrinsic qualities, the visual qualities the storytelling abilities and so on. It’s really a personal thing. Film is definitely part of media but it’s a stronger intrinsic media to other media forms.
Any advice to give to future filmmakers?
I think ultimately if you’re really serious about it, you will do things to achieve it. I mean, it’s a very know your short term goals and chart your long term goals… stamina is very important if you want to be a filmmaker; by stamina I mean creative stamina, economic stamina, social stamina and so forth. So if you really want it bad you’ll probably survive, but if it’s just a whim and fancy or hype, because now it’s so cool to be a media student, I think then it’s sad la because you’re wasting your time. It’s really about how hard you want it and how focussed you are in getting it or trying to get it.
How do you think making films or producing films has helped you or other people make a social statement?
I think producing film for me has always been a balance of commercial business, because this is career, and also the other side of the balance is something to say, you have to have something to say before you can make a film. That can be in a form of a social statement like Perth, it can be in a form of other intrinsic human characteristics. I think making film is about having something to say and crafting it so that you can share wit the audience. Because film is ultimately a very collaborative and very mass form of art. You have to know what you’re trying to say, you have to put your words out. For me, what better way to do that than being a producer, because a producer sees everything through from step one to step one thousand. You identify the message, you craft the story for the message, you get the people on board to tell this story. That has always been the driving force I think, I mean for Perth and other movies is to find that voice and find that need to tell it.
Why producing and not directing?
I think directing is a subset of producing. So producing a film product is really the overview where you can oversee and take care of the baby, so to speak. Somehow or rather directing has always been obviously the more glamorous path, but perhaps to me a less rewarding path, so maybe that’s why I prefer producing. But that’s not to say that I don’t want or cannot direct, I have directed before, but I think I gain more satisfaction perhaps? Actually Equal amount of frustration also, but I guess I prefer to be a producer, because you can really see the big picture, you can really look at things. Directing is just an aspect of a movie.
Written by: Jasmine Goh
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